I have about as much chance of interviewing Xi Jinping as I do of being the next quarterback of the Chiefs. But if I did, it would run something like this:
C: Thank you for seeing me today. Unlike most Americans, I’m not going to ask you about human rights or Taiwan or Ukraine. I’m going to focus on the meaning of “socialism with Chinese characteristics.”
X: OK. That sounds interesting.
C: Marx was a European. You don’t much care for European thought. Does that feel like a contradiction to you?
X: No. Marx was a product of his time and place. Some of what he said pertains to China; some does not. That’s what we mean by “socialism with Chinese characteristics.”
C: But Marx was putting forth dialectical materialism as a universal law. You and the CCP don’t appear to believe in universal laws, either.
X: Marx didn’t grow up in China. He didn’t know anything about China. He just thought we were a bunch of ignorant peasants living in the past. A lot of what he said didn’t apply to China, either then or now.
C: I think everyone would agree that Mao was a revolutionary. He broke a lot of things. He even went outside the party to break things when they got too stagnant. Are you a revolutionary like Mao?
X: Mao was a product of his time, too. He broke things that needed to be broken. Today, things are different. We’re building a China that is great again. We don’t need a revolution; we need to improve on what we have.
C: Based on what I’ve seen in your museums, the CCP’s claim to legitimacy is based on its success in overthrowing the hated foreigners, not the emperor, the aristocracy, and the bourgeoisie. Where’s the Marxism in that?
X: The powers that be in China at the time were lackeys of foreign imperialists. There is no contradiction between class struggle and anti-imperialism. We follow Lenin on that point.
C: But the Qings were in power in China long before the foreign devils had any influence over them.
X: They were foreign devils, too. The struggle against them was on behalf of the Chinese people.
C: Your office is located close to the Forbidden City. When you see it, are you impressed by the glory of Chinese culture, or do you see a monument to the oppression of workers and peasants?
X: Some of both. The French do the same thing with Versailles.
C: True, but France doesn’t claim to be a socialist state.
X: Neither does the CCP. We’re just on the way to true socialism.
C: The CCP has bourgeois members. There’s lots of inequality in China. Do you and the CCP really constitute the dictatorship of the proletariat?
X: We have to build a prosperous, industrial China before we can talk about true socialism. That’s one of the characteristics of socialism with Chinese characteristics. We work with the bourgeoisie in the short run, but we make it clear that we’re in charge, so to that extent, we are the dictatorship of the proletariat. Just ask all of the rich tycoons we’ve humbled over the last few years.
C: To the detriment of economic growth. Capital is fearful and distrustful of you now.
X: There are higher priorities than economic growth, important as it is. Maintaining the primacy of the party and the Chinese people as a whole over irresponsible capital is one of them.
C: So you would agree that China is not yet a classless society?
X: Yes. We’re working on it. Once we reach the requisite level of prosperity and have complete sovereignty over our area of the world, we can strive for full communism.
C: When do you think that will happen?
X: Probably not in my lifetime. It depends largely on what the capitalist countries do.
C: Will the Chinese state ever wither away, as Marx predicted?
X: Not while I’m in charge, that’s for sure. (Snickers)
C: Here’s my last question. China has always had a large, powerful, autocratic state. One could argue that the continuing existence of that state is one of the attributes of socialism with Chinese characteristics. Is that the case, or will the state at some point wither away?
X: We’ll have to see. We’re a long way from that point. It won’t happen in my lifetime.
C: Thank you for your time.